Who do you think you are kidding Mr Gray ?

Les Gray, who recently retired as chairman of the Scottish Police Federation was on BBC Newsnight Scotland spinning like a spider on Speed. Quite frankly Mr Gray came across as a petty minded man churning out the party line with no real substance to his rent a gob statements.

Below we will debunk some of Mr Gray’s fantasy remarks with cold hard honest facts.

LG: The police where left with absolutely no choice.They informed them it was an illegal procession.

TCN: The Police did have a choice, the very same choice they had to make when they policed an illegal gathering by anti fascist protesters in Glasgow hours earlier when they chose to stand off and make no arrests even although the organisers had been served with a letter from Campbell Corrigan  Assistant Chief Constable of Strathclyde Police informing them their gathering and march was illegal. The Green Brigade and we fellow protesters did not receive anything like this.

LG: This incident had nothing to do with the offensive behavior at football act.This is merely a public order incident.We have a crowd of people who have gathered and decided to have an unofficial Protest.

TCN: Massaging the fact’s here. Myself and others were there as a direct consequence of the Offensive Behavior at football act. If we did not feel your former colleagues were abusing the powers of this act then we would not have been there. You now say the protest was unofficial? So what is it Mr Gray ‘unofficial’ or ‘illegal’ ? Maybe you want to refer to our first reply.

LG: What if we have other organisations Doing that ?

TCN:  We do, every week. In fact that very morning as it happens. 

LG: There is a huge Health and Safety issue with These People who decide to do this week in week out. First of all the Police could not cover it, secondly there’s a huge Health and Safety issue with these people who walk down the street? …People may get knocked down and what if there was a secondary demonstration?

TCN:  Who are ‘these people’ ? Are you referring to people who would like to peacefully demonstrate against what they perceive as injustices ?  Ah and the old ‘Health and Safety’ patter ? Well there was NO counter demonstration and there never was going to be. I’m sure your ex colleagues already knew that or if not Police intelligence is in fact just an oxymoron and a waste of public funds. As for people getting knocked down there was a danger from that as young boys and members of the general public ran away from Police wielding batons. Oh and before we leave your favorite topic of Health and Safety we have to mention the fact that an innocent OAP in his seventies was caught up in and held in your former colleagues ‘Kettling’ while standing in freezing driving sleet. Aye health and safety right enough.

LG: The incident we seen the other day there was a serious threat to public order.

TCN:  Totally agree with that Les. There would have been a serious threat to public order if Celtic fans had not ignored aggressive Police tactics and remained peaceful.

LG: This wasn’t a crowd of people who turned up and gave out flowers and deciding we’ll just go for a wee walk here. They pulled their hoodies up and put scarves over their faces so they could not be identified….This wasn’t a peaceful protest…

TCN:  I don’t think anyone was expecting flowers, as you’ll remember Valentines day was last month. So flowers were not high on our agenda. Since when has it been a crime to pull on a hood which comes as part of a garment for that use or cover your face with a scarf ? I’m beginning to agree with Lwords that this seems to be an issue for the fashion Police. You also seem to have a miraculous talent for mind reading especially as you don’t appear to have been present at the incident. However you are right it wasn’t a peaceful protest..well it was really until Strathclyde Police turned up and started a game of ‘Let’s kid on it’s North Korea’.

LG: I can assure you that Strathclyde Police nor any other Police force in Scotland has the manpower or the will to just target people willy nilly.

TCN:  We’ll take that as an admission that the operation on Saturday was pre planned by Strathclyde Police. Thank you Sir.

You can see Mr Gray’s intellectual musings on the ‘Gallowgate Tea Party’ (kettle supplied) and other fine points of a free society here http://www.bbc.co.uk/iplayer/episode/b01rhdc7/Newsnight_Scotland_19_03_2013/

Warning- Nae hoodies, hoods, brollies, rainmates, scarfs, walking on the public highway or singing. Thanks

20 thoughts on “Who do you think you are kidding Mr Gray ?”

  1. I told you it wouldnt be hard to take that blowhards statement apart anyone who was listening to him must wonder how this idiot was a cop for so long, this is what we are up against, Saturday only increased support for the GB throughout the Celtic support, i myself couldnt be arsed with there constant complaining but after Berwick where there was only two arrests and Saturdays Jackboot performance from the cops i will support the GB and any other Celtic fan by going to any and all protests from now on, this nonsense has to be stopped now we are football fans not criminals

    1. I for one will be attending all protests regarding this bullying/harrasment I do not agree with some things the GB have done over the years politically,But I sure as hell will be 100% behind them+all other celtic supporters Together we stand Divided we fall

    2. Agree. All football fans need to put aside their differences and peacefully protest against this ever rising police state.
      As for MacAskill-resign you moron! “Sectarian march…” No wonder the legislation is referred to as ‘bad’ with this muppet as Justice Minister. Revealing his prejudice me thinks!

  2. I told you it wouldnt be hard to take that blowhards statement apart anyone who was listening to him must wonder how this idiot was a cop for so long, this is what we are up against, Saturday only increased support for the GB throughout the Celtic support, i myself couldnt be arsed with there constant complaining but after Berwick where there was only two arrests and Saturdays Jackboot performance from the cops i will support the GB and any other Celtic fan by going to any and all protests from now on, this nonsense has to be stopped now we are football fans not criminals

    1. I for one will be attending all protests regarding this bullying/harrasment I do not agree with some things the GB have done over the years politically,But I sure as hell will be 100% behind them+all other celtic supporters Together we stand Divided we fall

    2. Agree. All football fans need to put aside their differences and peacefully protest against this ever rising police state.
      As for MacAskill-resign you moron! “Sectarian march…” No wonder the legislation is referred to as ‘bad’ with this muppet as Justice Minister. Revealing his prejudice me thinks!

  3. It’ll never stop Joe. Strathclydes “finest” are largely drawn from followers of what Alex Salmond described as part of the fabric of our society.

    A good friend of mine has been a cop for 20 years. He is a hun, but that’s by the way. I asked him if he knew a rare Celtic supporting cop I became aware of, who just happened to be going out with a work colleague and he answered “aye, the fenian….” ….then realised what he had said and to whom he had said it. And he’s one of the decent ones.

    Fabric of our society indeed.

  4. It’ll never stop Joe. Strathclydes “finest” are largely drawn from followers of what Alex Salmond described as part of the fabric of our society.

    A good friend of mine has been a cop for 20 years. He is a hun, but that’s by the way. I asked him if he knew a rare Celtic supporting cop I became aware of, who just happened to be going out with a work colleague and he answered “aye, the fenian….” ….then realised what he had said and to whom he had said it. And he’s one of the decent ones.

    Fabric of our society indeed.

  5. McAskill is an arsehole of the highest order and the main reason I am seriously questioning my voting intentions in the forthcoming referendum.
    I have been s staunch SNP supporter for 30 years. McAskill, Graham, Salmond et all are rapidly curing me of that.

    1. In all my voting years I would never ever have thought that I would pass up the chance of Independence, but I have come to the same conclusion as you, that I think it would be to the detriment of my family, friends and community in general to vote for Independence for our country when ineptitude, self interest and moral corruption have been shown to be so prevalent in the very areas and classes in our country who should be examples of good citizenship. I never thought I would be put into a position of possibly having to choose the union flag over the Saltire. Salmon et al have scunnered me. If they fail, then they only have themselves to blame.

  6. McAskill is an arsehole of the highest order and the main reason I am seriously questioning my voting intentions in the forthcoming referendum.
    I have been s staunch SNP supporter for 30 years. McAskill, Graham, Salmond et all are rapidly curing me of that.

    1. In all my voting years I would never ever have thought that I would pass up the chance of Independence, but I have come to the same conclusion as you, that I think it would be to the detriment of my family, friends and community in general to vote for Independence for our country when ineptitude, self interest and moral corruption have been shown to be so prevalent in the very areas and classes in our country who should be examples of good citizenship. I never thought I would be put into a position of possibly having to choose the union flag over the Saltire. Salmon et al have scunnered me. If they fail, then they only have themselves to blame.

  7. I’ve got to laugh at the thought of the fear that must have ran through the ranks of the police when confronted by a group of people wearing hoods and scarves, whilst the poor police only had stab proof vests, pepper spray, tazers, batons, handcuffs, specialised tactics, mounted cavalry and the ability to arrest anyone who did not follow their instructions, the poor souls must have felt very vulnerable, of course I forgot their even heavier armed snatch squads that would likely waiting for it to turn ugly and round up the ringleaders.
    If the GB behave themselves and don’t do allow themselves to be dragged into any thing stupid, for I am sure that there will be agents provocateurs are at work as I write this, then the police will have to back off. It really is a pity we do not have a press who are interested in doing proper investigative reporting.

  8. I’ve got to laugh at the thought of the fear that must have ran through the ranks of the police when confronted by a group of people wearing hoods and scarves, whilst the poor police only had stab proof vests, pepper spray, tazers, batons, handcuffs, specialised tactics, mounted cavalry and the ability to arrest anyone who did not follow their instructions, the poor souls must have felt very vulnerable, of course I forgot their even heavier armed snatch squads that would likely waiting for it to turn ugly and round up the ringleaders.
    If the GB behave themselves and don’t do allow themselves to be dragged into any thing stupid, for I am sure that there will be agents provocateurs are at work as I write this, then the police will have to back off. It really is a pity we do not have a press who are interested in doing proper investigative reporting.

  9. Couldn’t agree more with your comments about this guy Gray. For a person who once held a responsible post of supposedly speaking for the rank and file, he is well out of order. To the best of my knowledge the Police Federation representatives are elected to put forward the views of their members, ie police officers up to the rank of chief inspector.
    Major policy decisions, like Saturday’s are made by Superintedents and above. Rest assured, the Police Federation had no say whatsoever in how this operation was or should have been dealt with.
    Why was this right wing, politically minded little man sitting in the studio of a national television service being asked his opinion on matters over which he had no influence?
    Only officers of the rank of Superintent or above had the power to make decisions on how the situation on Saturday was to be handled and everyone on the set last night was, or should have been, aware of this fact.
    It was sickening to see this smug opinionated person wallowing in his self importance spouting out drivel word after word. I understand he was not even anywhere near the Gallowgate on Saturday. Was he on duty?
    He was never asked what part he, or any member of the Police Federation had to play in police policy on Saturday?
    What was Les Gray doing on that programme?
    The main issue on Saturday was the questionable and in my opinion unlawful use of ” kettling tactics.” This was hardly touched upon and in any case had nothing whatsoever to do with Mr. Gray.
    I could go on about the misuse of kettling tactics by the Strathclyde Police but will say only that in some cases kettling may be legally employed, On this occasion kettling was illegal for a number of reasons amongst them,
    1. It was out of proportion,
    2. It was pre-planned.
    There are other reasons which add up to a breach of human rights.
    Should the Chief Constable of Strathclyde Police be charged with false imprisonment then many believe there is case to answer, but that’s a matter for those individuals who were subject to the unlawful behaviour of Strathclyde Police to take forward themselves, advisedly as a unified group and with legal advice.
    I am not a member of the Green Brigade, but putting Saturday aside, and this might not be a popular line to take, like many other Celtic followers, maybe the GB would be better advised to go through the proper procedure before making arrangements for a future march or demonstration. I am sure, after the latest fiasco, the authorities will be obliged to give matters more consideration not to mention the good name of Celtic being further upheld.

  10. Couldn’t agree more with your comments about this guy Gray. For a person who once held a responsible post of supposedly speaking for the rank and file, he is well out of order. To the best of my knowledge the Police Federation representatives are elected to put forward the views of their members, ie police officers up to the rank of chief inspector.
    Major policy decisions, like Saturday’s are made by Superintedents and above. Rest assured, the Police Federation had no say whatsoever in how this operation was or should have been dealt with.
    Why was this right wing, politically minded little man sitting in the studio of a national television service being asked his opinion on matters over which he had no influence?
    Only officers of the rank of Superintent or above had the power to make decisions on how the situation on Saturday was to be handled and everyone on the set last night was, or should have been, aware of this fact.
    It was sickening to see this smug opinionated person wallowing in his self importance spouting out drivel word after word. I understand he was not even anywhere near the Gallowgate on Saturday. Was he on duty?
    He was never asked what part he, or any member of the Police Federation had to play in police policy on Saturday?
    What was Les Gray doing on that programme?
    The main issue on Saturday was the questionable and in my opinion unlawful use of ” kettling tactics.” This was hardly touched upon and in any case had nothing whatsoever to do with Mr. Gray.
    I could go on about the misuse of kettling tactics by the Strathclyde Police but will say only that in some cases kettling may be legally employed, On this occasion kettling was illegal for a number of reasons amongst them,
    1. It was out of proportion,
    2. It was pre-planned.
    There are other reasons which add up to a breach of human rights.
    Should the Chief Constable of Strathclyde Police be charged with false imprisonment then many believe there is case to answer, but that’s a matter for those individuals who were subject to the unlawful behaviour of Strathclyde Police to take forward themselves, advisedly as a unified group and with legal advice.
    I am not a member of the Green Brigade, but putting Saturday aside, and this might not be a popular line to take, like many other Celtic followers, maybe the GB would be better advised to go through the proper procedure before making arrangements for a future march or demonstration. I am sure, after the latest fiasco, the authorities will be obliged to give matters more consideration not to mention the good name of Celtic being further upheld.

  11. a long number of years ago i worked with a protestant girl who refered to the police as orange bastards when i said that if a catholic said that they would appear in court and as the lawyer would be a smelly hun you would have to plead guilty

  12. a long number of years ago i worked with a protestant girl who refered to the police as orange bastards when i said that if a catholic said that they would appear in court and as the lawyer would be a smelly hun you would have to plead guilty

  13. It beggars belief that Kanny McCaskill, our esteemed Justice Secretary dodged the question with the following gem; “84% of those dealt with under the provisions of the Act have been successfully prosecuted”.
    I wonder what percentage of that number deserved to be arrested in the first place when you consider that they were detained and charged using this hotly disputed and ill-thought out Act.
    A minor secondary point if I may.
    Independence is largely reliant upon the SNP voters. Nationalism is a dirty word to our blue neighbours who make no secret of the fact that they fully support Unionism (probably for all the wrong reasons it has to be said). It would seem that SNP are alienating a large percentage of their backers here with this preposterous act which criminalises football fans and is left to a largely Union-friendly police force to implement. AND implement unfairly.

  14. It beggars belief that Kanny McCaskill, our esteemed Justice Secretary dodged the question with the following gem; “84% of those dealt with under the provisions of the Act have been successfully prosecuted”.
    I wonder what percentage of that number deserved to be arrested in the first place when you consider that they were detained and charged using this hotly disputed and ill-thought out Act.
    A minor secondary point if I may.
    Independence is largely reliant upon the SNP voters. Nationalism is a dirty word to our blue neighbours who make no secret of the fact that they fully support Unionism (probably for all the wrong reasons it has to be said). It would seem that SNP are alienating a large percentage of their backers here with this preposterous act which criminalises football fans and is left to a largely Union-friendly police force to implement. AND implement unfairly.

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